It seems that silliness is not confined to the US and the French.  Now the Germans want to get into the act.  

From Reuters via Excite:

German Professors Declare War on English Terms
Apr 9, 8:48 am ET

By Erik Kirschbaum and Dave Graham
BERLIN (Reuters) - A group of German university professors, angered by the U.S.-British war against Iraq, have launched a campaign to replace many popular English-language words used in Germany with French terms.

Saying they are appalled by the way the United States and Britain defied the will of the United Nations and attacked Iraq, the four professors declared war on borrowed English terms in German such as "okay," "T-shirt" and "party."

They have devised French-language alternatives: "d’accord," "tricot" and "fete."

"We won’t accept the United States as a role model as long as it is violating international law so this seemed to be an appropriate way to protest peacefully," Armin Burkhardt, a professor of German at Magdeburg University, told Reuters.

"We aren’t trying to purify the language, we’re trying send a political signal to show we’re against this war which has no legal foundation," said Burkhardt, who is chairman of the group "Language in Politics" (http://www.sprache-in-der-politik.de).
. . .

See the full article more details.

German Professors Declare War on English Terms

That’s probably the dumbest thing I ever heard.

- PW  

*Tries to suppress a snigger*

...

*Fails*

It’s funny in its absurdness. Which I think is part of the idea - it’s not any worse than freedom fries.

~Silver

not any worse than freedom fries

God knows, that’s true enough.

- PW

YAAAAAARG!!! That was supposed to be S N I G G E R, a type of laugh! Not a slur!

Another victim of the so-called "filter", which makes things worse than they were originally. Pew!

- PS

I am but an alter-ego.

~Silver

*Mystery girl peeps out from behind the screen, then quickly ducks back before identification*

[quote author=Stargzer link=board=translate;num=1050019874;start=0#0 date=04/10/03 at 20:11:14][center]...[/center]See the full article more details.

I found this fascinating—for those who want a more direct link to the article in question try the following : aktuelles. I, too, become irritated when I see the word «dejt» used instead of «treff» or «mejl» instead of «epost», nor am I terribly enchanted when I see or hear the phrase «det suger». But Professors Dr Burkhardt and Liedtke and Dr Kornelia Pape and Priv.-Doz. Dr. Jörg Kilian—and, it must be admitted, I myself sometimes—somehow remind me of King Canute battling the waves….

Henri

Absolute silliness. To make matters worse, many of the French words on their list are already in use in German with slightly different meanings. Tricot, for example, is the shirt with the team colors worn by a member of sports team. Note also how they’ve not mentioned a single computer term, except for "computer" itself, which is actually just as often called by the German word Rechner. What on earth are we going to do about Internet, Software, Hardware, eMail, Browser, CD, Video, etc. etc. etc.?

Sure, I don’t really see why people use family instead of Familie, soft instead of weich or killen instead of töten. But American culture happens to be in and so there will be a cultural drift, and I don’t see that changing soon.

Ilka

First, I would like to say that the German professors are up to an impossible task fighting popularity.
Seccond, I would like to point out that it is difficult for most of you in an exporting language area to realize the agony people feel who are in the reciving end.  But take import/export of other goods, and I remember the angry comments in the US about Japanese car imports.  It´s different but the same.  Things/words familiar are changed, whether it´s the car park or the lingo and many, many people feel fustrated.
As we can see from the WoTD section a huge amount of "English" words have been imported BUT that was a long time ago.  So I guess it´s the same thing as with architecture—it takes about 80 years before a new building gets accepted and will be considered beatiful.

I LIKE imported words.  8) Except when they’re horribly mangled - I hate it when they’re mispronounced.

~Silver

[quote author=Iterman link=board=translate;num=1050019874;start=0#11 date=04/13/03 at 05:31:39]As we can see from the WoTD section a huge amount of "English" words have been imported BUT that was a long time ago.  So I guess it´s the same thing as with architecture—it takes about 80 years before a new building gets accepted and will be considered beautiful.

English still imports words, though the volume has gone way down. And much like it’s done for centuries, English continues to produce technical and scientific words based on Latin and Greek. These latter words, with localizations, are also produced in many other languages.

I just read an article regarding Denglish, the German word for the German language when it contains many Anglicisms. I’m sure it’ll be of interest to all who live in countries that have a large influx of English words into the local language so I thought I’d summarize it here (Sitran, the alarm bells are deafening ). I found particularly interesting the likening of the effects on language of the digital age to that of book printing. The article is from the foremost German computer magazine, C’T.

______________________

At first glance, the number of Anglicisms found in German appears to be huge. There is not a commercial, not a speech, not a website without them: Computer, Internet, Chip, Handy, Service, Joystick, ge-emailt, downloaden, heruntergescrollt. They come primarily from information technology, advertising and (I believe) the music industry. In actual fact, of the ca. 400 000 words in the German language, only about 10% are foreign words and of these only a few hundred are Anglicisms. They do however represent a disproportionately high number of words in common use.

About 50% of Germans are bothered by the Anglicisms, particularly the older population. The reasons given range from preserving the German cultural heritage, ensuring that the youth learn proper German and protection of the less educated who don’t know English. Many see Anglicisms as something that has been forced onto the German language from the outside. Much of the rejection of Denglish is also grounded in a wariness of the things the new words represent, specifically the new technology.

Historically, German speakers, unlike speakers of French, Spanish and English, did not have a single nation of their own. Therefore, a common language played a central role in politically unifying the small feudal states. Kant‘s famous dictum is expressive of this history: „No greater damage can be inflicted on a nation than when it is robbed of its national character, the uniqueness of its spirit and its language.“

The history of attempts to purify the German language of foreign elements goes back to the 1800s and has always coincided with political upheaval: 1871 Foundation of the German Empire, 1933, 1945, 1989. This reflects an attempt to strengthen the national identity by removing non-German elements. In light of European unification and globalization, these efforts no longer do us a service in a world in which language must break down barriers to a unified Europe and beyond.

Linguists identify the primary driving force behind the influx of Anglicisms to be digital communications technology. Its influence on the German language can be likened to the effect that the advent of printing had on the vernacular. Book printing brought about a standardization in writing. This in turn led to the emergence of a common language which was superimposed over the regional dialects. By the end of the 1600s, the various European languages had become sufficiently standardized to form a foundation upon which nationalism could arise and divide the peoples of Europe into nation states. Thus, with the emergence of book printing technology began the transition from multilingual kingdoms, in which different peoples were unified under a dynasty, to modern nations that are unified under a common language. Today, the modern global data network is beginning to upset this national isolation – not only from an economic and political standpoint but also with regard to languages. Much as book printing once weakened the power of the clergy and aristocracy by reducing the influence of Latin, so global networking is now drawing the rug out from under the isolated national languages. Efforts to purify the language, which in the past served to unify the nation under one language, have now lost their function as in the course of economic globalization and the European unification the importance of „the German“ or „the French“ dwindles and the intermingling of languages actually becomes a positive sign for the cultural unification of the continent.

Up until the middle of the 20th century, the average citizen never traveled beyond the area where his language was spoken. Ludwig Wittgenstein said in a double entendre, „The limits of my language constitute the limits of my world.“ In contrast, young people of today grow up in a global mass culture with an American imprint and live in an English-language data world. With the PC and networking, a new elite has arisen in all advanced nations: the „symbolic analysts, the virtual class“. Increasingly, its members feel less and less bound by national borders with regard to language and business. The new Anglicisms are not seen as something that contaminates the national language but rather as something that demonstrates progress, freedom, cultural diversity, lifestyle. The new words are seen as part of a new global language of the future. National languages are associated with local narrowness while the Anglicisms usher in the global freedom of the digital age.

Linguists predict that Germany will become a fully bilingual state in which both the world language and the local language are spoken.
____________________________

I think German is undergoing a development much like English did when French influence entered the language. Can anyone tell me how long it took for French to occupy a substantial portion of the English vocabulary?

Can anyone tell me how long it took for French to occupy a substantial portion of the English vocabulary?  

I don’t think anyone can give you a definite answer to that, ilka. Indeed, from the viewpoint of the Norman nobility, it might be more a case of when English occupied a substantial portion of the French language.

In any event, key dates in this fascinating development are:

1066 - Norman invasion
1204 - Loss of Normandy
1362 - Statute of Pleading

So in simple terms, following the Norman invasion and the retooling of the entire English administration, the nobility and much of the social apparatus of the time spoke Norman French. Gradually, the Saxon (Old English) language became peppered with Norman French and vice versa to become what we refer to today as Middle English. This merging process was reinforced and accellerated by the loss of Normandy in 1204 as contact between the Norman English nobility and Normandy itself dwindled. By 1362, Norman French and Old English had essentially merged to become a single Middle English, which became the official language of England in 1362. From around 1400 and for the following century, the Great Vowel Shift took place, further homogenizing the language into what, by about 1500, had become Early Modern English.

So, my answer to your question would be a couple of hundred years. That’s my best guess, anyhow.

- PW

Thank you, PW. I am wondering how we can then predict the amount of time it will take for English to make up, say, 1/3 of German. I would guess that at that time in England, the common people would have looked up to the ruling class and it would have been "cool" to use their French words, much as it is cool to use English words in German today. Germans have the additional pressure of needing English to communicate on a global scale and English is taught in schools, both of which would not have been factors in England at the time.

I wonder if the languages won’t merge even more quickly than English and French.

Ilka

[quote author=Ilka link=board=translate;num=1050019874;start=15#16 date=04/18/03 at 11:25:23]I am wondering how we can then predict the amount of time it will take for English to make up, say, 1/3 of German.

Is ‘weekend’ a common expression in Germany? I ask because I know it has become popular in France, and because English ‘week’ is related to German ‘woch.’

So when do we decide that a linguistic borrowing isn’t really just a kind of going home?